Critiques
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from shutterhack/Fadzly (665) 
on September 18, 2008 1:50:30 AM CDT
(1)
I like this portrait of your parents very much Sheila, very intimate and emotive. It's even technically very good.
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from facewithered/Puchong (9,650)
on June 11, 2008 12:02:25 AM CDT
(4)
Hi Sheila, I needed to check your portfolio to find if there would be any newly posted pictures and found this one. Every photos of one's parents need to be supported by at least 2TU viewers because taking pictures of one's parents itself could be very meaningful for the photographer regardless of its quality. I see some of you in your father's face. ^^ After looking at Larry Sultan's family photos, I automatically came to look after the hidden expressions. What are they? They are respects for members of a family. They are not printed in the sheet of paper but revealed in the way the photographer takes them. Technically the background looks not serviceable enough for your parents who spent long long a time together. The wood railings have no respect for your parents, they are just railings. The beautiful green forest in the back remains as just an unknown forest. They don't have respect for your parents because they haven't spent the long long time with them. So in my very poor opinion, that abrupt appearance of the background seem to have no proper respectful right for your precious parents though your father and mother are leaning against each other so gracefully just as they might have been so far so long. They look natural but not special but that's the faces of our parents. If they had been smiling for you, those smiles would have taken every partikle of untold stories of your parents. I think taking portraits of people is showing the photographer's respect for their life. What I am longing to do for my parents is taking them in their normal clothes and in their house where they spent so long a time together, in the room where every things has its own stories and memories and in the manner that I stand as a son of them, not a photographer. This picture affects me so hard because I see the faces of my parents in your parent's faces. It's aching and pleasant. I don't figure out which is real. I am very happy to meet your father you told me about before. I imagined what he would look like. You resembled your father. I see something in your father's face. Something sad, something worried, something aching, something harsh. And I see something in your mother's face. It is covered by her half-smile but it has also a tint of heavy emotion. Dark eyes and fading-away smile left over in your father's mouth are like arrows stuck in my heart. Those things manufacture the respect right in your picture. I feel respects for their life. Look at the way they stand! How mixed those two are to the point of the one! Puchong
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From tvernuccio/Sheila (37,110) 
on June 11, 2008 11:19:22 AM CDT
hi Puchong, Your critique certainly gave me a lot to think about...particularly what you said about the background. I agree with you that this background is not very good, and after I took this photo, I realized that and shot this at a different angle in which the waterfalls became the background.
What's interesting about this particular area that a I shot the photo is that it's a place that my father spent much time at as a child with his family. The trees in the background are trees that were there when he was here as a young boy. Does my image reflect that? No. I appreciate you mentioning that aspect because you made me realize how important the background is. Taking a picture of my parents and trying to somehow make the background "respect" them certainly is a challenge, and something I will try to remember in the future. In the photo which I will upload next, I hope the background choice I made (the waterfalls) will convey that better.
Thank you also for addressing the emotional aspect of the photo and how that affects you, as well as how the expressions of my parents come across to you. You said you see "something sad, something worried, something aching, something harsh" in my Dad's face and the "tint of heavy emotion" in my Mom's face.
This is a time of uncertainty in my family. My father has been told he needs to undergo major surgery, but he is waiting to make that decision until he has more tests and a second opinion. Perhaps what you see in their faces and eyes comes from that.
Thank you again for taking the time to look at this picture of my folks and tell me your impressions. You have made me think about taking pictures of my parents differently, and I appreciate that.
I will be interested to see the photos of your family that you will take in their home. That will be a most worthy photographic journey and one which I'm sure will result in photos that you will treasure the rest of your life. Cheers! sheila
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from robertwallis/Robert (12,910)
on June 7, 2008 12:08:01 AM CDT
(5)
It's a very expressive and sensitive portrait of your parents. That's the important thing to catch :-) Your dad has the guy thing down pat as some of the others have said including the "foot forward and heel holding up the wall behind" so it doesn't creep up on him. I recognize that from my high school days in Kentucky. I think we were taught that was the way to stand around in the hallway when we were in the 7th grade ;-) It does affect me on an emotional level, so you are seeing it as others do and not just because it's your parents. It's a good expressive image of a couple that still love each other and the warmth of the relationship shows through. Yeah, the backlighting kicked your butt on this one I'm afraid to say. The rule of thumb pre-digital was to open up two stops, and I'll guess that a one to a one and a half exposure bump would have done it for the faces. Then the problem becomes having the background blow out on you. I pulled this into PSE5 and had a go at it to see what could be done. I've posted a rework for you here to see how it came out. Click on "all sizes" in the UL corner of the image, and you'll go to the larger size. The link takes you to the size that has the description of work done and attribution. I opened the shadows a bunch in the Lighting section and then lowered the Highlights to bring down the shirts and shoulders some. That opened up the faces a bunch and you can see their eyes better. That left the rest of the image looking fairly flat, so I went back and burned in every thing except the faces and down to their waists. I didn't do a detailed complete job on it, just enough to bring their faces out of the shadows and open it up some. I burned along the wood work, the stones, and the woods behind them. I think I would probably go back and darken down the trees some more to make your parents stand out more, and probably work on the clothing some more. Hopefully, there's enough info here to get you started in a different direction for the post processing on this
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From robertwallis/Robert (12,910)
on June 8, 2008 11:30:34 PM CDT
Hi, sorry to be so long to get back with you here. The last couple of days have been crazy with getting printing done. I've got another art fair this coming weekend, and it's time to get stuff done for that :-) The first version looks the better one. The second version has the clothing too dark and contrasty. I looked at what I did the other night on this and pulled all three into the screen at the same time so I could get a better comparison. What I had done needed more density and contrast, but at the time I was trying to pull the faces out of the shadows which did work. I tried using Curves and was able to get a bit more natural tonality to it. After tweaking with Curves, I tried to lower the brightness some in order to take care of the highlights/hotspots bit all it did was bring it back to the starting point. I feel that using the burn tool may be the best way to get the localized control you're after. I set the brush size to about 90 pixels in order to do the burning around their heads and shoulders. Set the density to about 6% and keep sweeping it back and forth with the right mouse button held down. The action builds up gradually, not right away. That way you've got more control over the action. When you set the brush to midtones, it won't have too much action on the T-shirts. Don't worry about getting it precisely on the edges of them, it's okay for the edge of the circle to brush against them some as it won't build up like the center part will. This is where the Teamviewer program would be handy, you can share desktops and see what's going on. I used that with an online class I did last summer, and it was great for showing someone how to do something on a PC. The other possibility would be to do this in layers, of which I've done precious little. One layer could be for the faces and bodies to get that exposure nailed, and then get the background worked out okay. You might try posting the original file, and I could give it a shot and then give a log of what I did. I did something along these lines years ago using the wet darkroom. I printed one portion in #5 contrast, very low tonal range, sort of like the faces and that spread out the tonality. Then the background needed a 2 stop burn and about #1-1/2 grade contrast for the BG. To do that, I made a print and used an X-Acto knife to trim out the subject for a burning mask. That's pretty much what layers does in theory. Maybe someone can offer the detailed advice on how to do that.
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From tvernuccio/Sheila (37,110)
on June 9, 2008 12:25:42 AM CDT
hi Robert, thanks so much for taking a look at both my reworks, and there's no need to apologize. I just appreciate your input and help. :) The first rework was the one I thought was better too. I thought I went too far in the second one.
The editing I did to brighten the shadows was done in layers. I've used the burn tool before, but not very often. Almost every time I try to use it, I just mess everything up. I have used it successfully a few times, but that's it. Thanks for the tip on the density setting. I just reduced mine and tried it but it still looks funny.
What number do you punch in for "step"? I have mine set at 55 right now, but I have changed it lower and higher and still I can't get the burning to look right. I have opacity set at 20 and hardness at 7.
I wanted to make sure I understood you right. Are you saying you can set the burn brush to midtones? I don't see anyway to do that with the editing software I use (Paint Shop Pro 7).
I'd be happy to show you the original file. I would be very appreciate for any help, and a detailed log of what you did would be awesome. The only thing is if you're using photoShop and I'm using Paint Shop Pro, I don't know how easy it will be for me to duplicate the steps you did. It might be better for me to keep practicing with the burn tool and then try to work in layers. If we used the same editing software that would make things easier. :)
Anyway, thanks again for all your help. I really appreciate it! And take your time on getting back to me so you can get everything ready for your art fair. I'm in no hurry. :) Take it easy, sheila
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From robertwallis/Robert (12,910)
on June 9, 2008 8:01:33 AM CDT
I just took a look at the original, and popped it into PSE5 and had a go at it again. It takes going WAY over the top in terms of usual adjustment, and some unusual directions, but it's showing some promise. It involves working first in color to really stretch the tones, then going to B&W, and then using an infrared simulation, then adding some color back to it to get away from the cold grays, and adding some noise/grain to soften it up some....It's not done yet, but there's some a good possibility of it working out well. I have a copy of PSP, maybe version 6, that I've never loaded up. When things slow down some, I'll load it up and take a look at it using that program. A friend of mine uses that exclusively, as she's an artist, but she does a lot of photowork too. She'll be a good resource when I bump into problems with that one. I can see a 14" square print of this one in the future ;-)
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from kashmegi/Kashmegi (4,455)
on June 6, 2008 6:12:33 PM CDT
(5)
Hi Sheila,not tech perfect and i wish i could see your parents feet,but i love the pose,that bonded look that comes from years of being together,your dad's body open to your mother but not showing to much emotion[as men do] and her clasped embrace,probably not main page material but as you are so nice and well thought of its deserved,one to treasure.Thanks.K.
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from johngoyer/John (84,201)
on June 6, 2008 4:13:26 PM CDT
(6)
Some shots need to be technically perfect, some don't - this is a keeper for me despite the lighting - has a great mood to it and the emotional content makes up for the shadows - I'd crop some of the trees on top but otherwise wouldn't "fix" the darkness in areas - i think it adds to the realism of the shot whereas using fill-flash or having perfect illumination would destroy something precious here - have a nice weekend! John
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from night/Bartek (11,927)
on June 6, 2008 2:05:28 PM CDT
(6)
Hi Sheila. For my taste lack of light isn't a problem. The emotion comming from the photo is so big that nothing really distracts me from it. From Your photos and Your comments I think I can say that You are very emotive person. And this photo suits to you very nice. Yes it's a bit sad, but full of love. And yes, the photo brings many feelings with itself. White area on the left from Your parents is a bit overexposed and it distracts me, but as I said, not very much. Composition is good. Beautiful one. I have always problem to criticize Your photos, because they always have so many good critiques and always feel that I have nothing more to add;P just joking;) Best regards, Bartek
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From night/Bartek (11,927)
on June 7, 2008 12:35:41 AM CDT
Yes, I also find it a bit sad:)
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from hankbenson/Hank (52,505)
on June 6, 2008 9:25:17 AM CDT
(7)
Good, expressive family snap. You have enough technical observations so I'll just say that my predominant reaction was, "great." Lucky them, lucky you. One doesn't see this free expression of affection between couples that often and I'd hazard a guess that his easy comfort derives in part from her demonstrativeness. Not a bad thing. Regards..Hank
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from zoltanm/zmaroti (1,075)
on June 6, 2008 1:59:12 AM CDT
(9)
Overall the tones and the feel of the picture is very film like and I like it. I don't take this as a portrait but raher an atmospheric shot, and in my opinion you captured the moment and mood very well. The lights could have been better or rather with some more work (reflector sheets) you could have made an artistic shot from this theme but then you might loose the intimate family mood of the picture.
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from deleted224040/deleted (30,149)
on June 6, 2008 12:25:41 AM CDT
(12)
sheila, i feel like your wide crop is not right for this photo. of course you probably want to show the scene, but i think this sort of loving pose and body language needs to be cropped in tighter, much tighter. i feel like that would emphasize the point of the photograph more. i have taken many photos, that were underexposed, but the emotional content was strong enough to cause me to salvage or at least attempt to salvage them. they look loving. they look loving towards you. ok, so the lighting is not perfect, like a professional portrait. is that really that big of a deal. i think given your photo and situation and emotional content, your okay. i really like something about both of their expressions. it's inviting yet sort of private in a way. when you look at this photo, if you are trying to judge it against a "professional portrait", it falls short, like the arm across him, (that sort of thing), but to me this looks like a snapshot of sorts, but not meant in a derogatory way, but rather as a photo for a family album that will be treasured. one that will bring back a memory of this time in your life. i think shots like this can be more memorable than studio portraits. because i think they remind you of a fun or memorable time in your life. studio portraits i think often don't really remind people of anything except they were in a studio and stressed trying to get themselves ready for the photograph and basically documented their faces and well, that's about it... sometimes anyway. but i have shots like this and i think i like them better of my family then the formal posed portraits or the studio shots that have much better technicals. i say that because the way she is embracing him is so natural. it's not "posed" at all. it's like you walked up to them doing this. sheila, i like your photo. it's real. it's like i know them by this photograph. you know them. you can some how bring that out of them and show it to us. tommy
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From deleted224040/deleted (30,149)
on June 6, 2008 11:59:04 PM CDT
hi sheila,
you know, actually i'm not sure why putting the arm like that is a no no, but it has always seemed to me to be so. it could probably work, but i think that it would have to be in a way where not so much of the arm was showing and where the back of her hand was not showing. it's probably more a part of classical portraiture posing... i could be totally off here. maybe someone else can say for sure. i hope i'm right and not just spouting off some craziness! haha.
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from mjhanegraaf/Mike (5,369)
on June 5, 2008 11:18:22 PM CDT
(11)
Sheila - someone else has been posting photos under your PhotoSIG account name recently ... ;o). Not accustomed to this subject matter in your posts!
I don't think anyone else can ever have the same depth of emotional reaction to this photo as you have, given they are your parents. However, it's clear to me that they are very much in love and very comfortable with each other.
You've already touched on detail loss in the shadows, particularly under your Dad's hat. Perhaps you could use 'layers' and a mask to lighten the shadow a bit? Another concern I have is that you've cut off their feet just above their ankles. I think it would be better to either get/crop closer (upper half of the body) or eliminate some of the negative space above their heads by composing with their feet in the image.
Have fun with your bird photography (sounds like that should be underway now). I so enjoy your abstract work (so inventive and creative), it makes me feel a little better (selfishly) to realize that even you have something to learn about other areas of photography! I'm a big fan, Sheila.
Mike
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From tvernuccio/Sheila (37,110)
on June 6, 2008 10:43:16 AM CDT
hi Mike, Thanks so much for the nice words that you said about my pictures...glad you like my weird abstract stuff. :) Oh man...I have TONS to learn about all areas of photography...so much to learn that I feel like I've barely scratched the surface!
Thanks also for taking the time to give me some feedback on this picture. I did you use layers to try to selectively brighten the shadows on their faces, but I think I'll take your advice and try to see if I can brighten them a little more.
Yep...I cut their feet and have way too much space above them, and that doesn't look very good compositionally. I'll play around with trying to crop it so it looks better.
I'm glad that in looking at this picture you were able to see the love my parents have for each other, as well as how comfortable they are together. They got married on my Mom's 16th birthday and have been married 45 years now and are still very much in love. :)
As far as the bird photography, I had fully intended to spend quite a bit of time with that, but as it turns out, I spent very little of my time taking pictures while we were at my folks' places. We spent a lot of time sitting out on the back porch talking, visiting my uncle who's recovering from surgery, and riding around, enjoying the mountains and beautiful Appalachian countryside.
Yesterday when my husband and I went out to take pictures, I had hoped to do some bird photography but for some reason, the cicadas seemed to think I was a tree or something. I couldn't do anything 'cause they kept landing on me and flying right into my face while ignoring my husband. Perhaps they were attracted to the bright colors I was wearing? Anyway...I'll try some bird photography next week I reckon. :)
Anyway, it seems I've been rambling on here...oops. :) Thanks again for the feedback and for the nice things you said about my pictures. :) Cheers! sheila
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From karin2007/Karin (19,609)
on June 6, 2008 6:50:33 AM CDT
Hi Sheila! Being able to catch such a precious moment and preserve it forever - that is what photography is about ... looking at such a photo with loved ones also reminds me that unfortunately nothing stays forever - things will change over the course of time - thats why it is so important to enjoy the present and be thankful for happy moments ... Cheers, Karin
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From dickhiggins/Dick (634)
on June 6, 2008 6:18:23 PM CDT
It's all been analyzed and discussed ... except maybe for the 'guy' thing in the picture. Mom's into the hug and togetherness and all ... as mom's usually are in the family snaps ... but dad, on the other hand, does the manly guy thing ... a bit aloof, eyes a bit shaded ... the only real 'him' contact that he initiates is that sneaky little bit of thumb peeking around mom's back. He's more intent on holding up that railing. I'm a guy ... but I've never understood it either.
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